SES wrote:

Oh, please. As an example of how "rude" and "terrible" President Trump is, the writer uses "he threw rolls of paper towels at hurricane victims"? Really?

I didn't even bother to read beyond that bit of utter stupidity.

========================================

Is that how you typically make decisions??  Reading or hearing a couple of sentences and then dismissing the rest as if you have any idea what it said because you've found something to ridicule ?? 

It appears to me that you read/listen to/watch something that you expect to disagree with by actively looking for the first thing that you can criticize and then dismiss the whole thing as if that's ALL there is. 

Sorry, that's as absurd as judging something you've not read, seen, heard, or know ANYTHING about and pretending that you do. 

Do you understand how little value such an opinion has to anyone else ??
 

SES wrote:

Yes, when in the very first sentence, the author makes an asinine comment like - tossing paper towels to laughing and smiling people indicates that the President is "rude" and "terrible" - that makes anything else that the author has to say suspect and not worth my time.

========================================

Well, that's a shame because you're likely missing all kinds of things because you tune out the second you object to something you read.

The tossed paper towels was seen as belittling and inconsiderate from the perspective of most Puerto Ricans.  I do have to agree that it was hardly worthy of mention in the article, but the rest of the article was a conviction of tRUMP as a rude boor without an ounce of class in how he behaves, speaks, or thinks. 

There's little doubt that he has seriously lowered the normal, accepted standards of public behavior in American politicians.  The article goes on the mention that his rude, boorish behavior is part of why SOME of his supporters like him. 

That's just sad. 

American politics is nasty enough without making OUTRIGHT nastiness acceptable.  I'm not very fond of excessive PC attitudes, but public decency and exhibiting some manners and standards in behavior isn't a bad thing or something that needed to be trashed.  It's bad enough that tRUMP has somehow made dishonesty from the POTUS acceptable to millions.

YMMV, but I'd hope that you think that decency and good manners in the behavior of this country's leaders is a good thing ??
 

SES wrote:

I didn't tune out because I read something to which I "objected". That WOULD be unfortunate.

I tuned out when I read a bald-faced lie, in the very first sentence, that reveals the author as totally biased and unreliable.
 

=============================

A "bald-faced lie" ??  Are you suggesting that he DIDN'T say & do what is written in the first paragraph?  There is plenty of room to disagree that something might not be rude or vulgar, or maybe shouldn't be in the article as vulgar or violent, but WHAT ISN'T TRUE that he did ??

(I'm ignoring that you said the very first SENTENCE when you likely meant PARAGRAPH)

For your convenience, the entire first paragraph is below in red.  What ISN'T true and is a "bald-faced lie"  ?

"You are a rude, terrible person," President Trump said to a reporter, not to his mirror, earlier this month. This was rich coming from a man who, as president, threatened to beat up a former vice president of the United States, called a porn star "Horseface," and threw rolls of paper towels at hurricane victims.
 

Last edited by Siagiah (5/02/2019 5:50 pm)

I would say that the paper towel throwing indicated a general insensitivity. It is akin to rudeness, although if one is being specific, I could see a differentiation.

The Puerto Ricans (who, by the way, are still reeling from the aftermath of that same hurricane, and who are still waiting on promised aid), were in a desperate situation. In similar situations, what have other presidents done? They have rolled up their sleeves and pitched in. They served meals, at least. Or they did something useful. Trump, on the other hand, did something disruptive.

Do you suppose that the standard method of distributing the supplies was tossing them into the crowd? No. Of course not. Trump was looking for a photo op, and obviously wasn't thinking of the people.

And what he did speaks volumes more. By throwing the paper towels, he kept a distance from the people. He didn't have to touch them. He didn't have to engage with them. It was a very unfortunate snapshot of how Trump consistently gets it wrong.

You could make the argument that what he did wasn't technically rude. But it would be a semantic argument designed to dodge the inescapable point of the article: that Trump is extremely rude.

So, by all means. Score the point on the semantic argument, but lose the debate on Trump's character.

Amadeus

SES wrote:

And in my opinion, the President was there, in part, to raise spirits, and if you actually watch the video of the event, people were laughing and smiling and cheering and raising their hands so the President would toss some to THEM, too.

Stating that the event was in any way, semantic or otherwise, an indication of "rudeness" or being "terrible" poisons anything else that the author has to say with ignorant bias.

 

================================

So, you're stuck on ONE paragraph and willfully refuse to see the rest of it because.... ??  It might show you that tRUMP, is, in FACT, extremely rude and lacking of an ounce of class ?? AND vulgar and violent besides...

BTW, the author said he's vulgar and violent.  tRUMP said that a REPORTER was RUDE & TERRIBLE.  Those are HIS words, NOT the author's.

Last edited by Siagiah (5/03/2019 2:27 pm)

SES wrote:

The first (he threatened to beat up Biden) and last (that tossing paper towels to [not "at"] hurricane victims indicates that he's "rude" and "terrible") are both bald-faced lies.

And your concerns that people should be nice when verbally attacked by a woman who f*cks people for cash are duly noted.

===================================

If you'd bothered to actually READ the article, you'd know that the author said tRUMP is VIOLENT and VULGAR.  (Hint, it's in the title too)

tRUMP is the one who said a reporter is RUDE and TERRIBLE. 

So, you've got it all wrong from the git go.

tRUMP is violent and vulgar.  Surely you cannot deny that ?? 

Just two examples: He threatened to beat up Biden... Telling police not to be gentle with those they arrest (IOW, harm them).  Telling rally attendees to beat up hecklers & he'd pay for their defense.  Plus, numerous other examples of his violent nature.  

A quick listen to the tape of him talking about being able to "grab 'em by the p****" … References to sh*t hole countries.  vulgar.
 

SES[size=100 wrote:

][/size]" 'You are a rude, terrible person,' President Trump said to a reporter, not to his mirror, earlier this month. This was rich coming from a man who, as president, threatened to beat up a former vice president of the United States, called a porn star 'Horseface,' and threw rolls of paper towels at hurricane victims."

Now, isn't that the author using the "Pot calling the kettle black" argument?

How could Trump call anyone else "rude" and "terrible"? Look how "rude" and "terrible" HE is, throwing paper towels at people?

btw - The Author's "threatened to beat up Biden" thing is TOTALLY misleading, bordering on dishonest.
 

=============================

C'mon, surely you know that tRUMP encourages violence and actually approves of it whether or not the remark about beating up Biden was exaggerated...

https://www.washingtonpost.com/politics/2019/03/14/trump-again-nods-toward-violence-by-his-supporters-maybe-something-bigger/?noredirect=on

No matter what the White House says, President Trump has repeatedly and not-subtly suggested his supporters could be violent — sometimes in an approving manner. And there’s a common thread running through much of it: Again and again, Trump has suggested they could rise up if they feel either they or Trump have been wronged by the political process.

 There are several examples. The most well-worn was when Trump suggested during the 2016 campaign that “Second Amendment people” could stop a President Hillary Clinton from installing liberal judges. Trump played it off as a coincidence unrelated to violence that he flagged gun-rights supporters as the last line of defense against a political outcome he opposed.

 Now, Trump is at it again. And this time, his statement has overtones of something bigger.
 In an interview with Trump-friendly Breitbart News this week, Trump talked about how “tough” the left was getting, relative to his supporters. His quote meanders a little bit, but stick with it and focus on the text in bold:

 

It’s so terrible what’s happening. You know, the left plays a tougher game, it’s very funny. I actually think that the people on the right are tougher, but they don’t play it tougher. Okay? I can tell you, I have the support of the police, the support of the military, the support of the Bikers for Trump – I have the tough people, but they don’t play it tough until they go to a certain point, and then it would be very bad, very bad. But the left plays it cuter and tougher. 

---------

As The Washington Post’s David Nakamura pointed out, this is actually quite similar to something Trump said at a September campaign rally for now-Sen. Josh Hawley (R) in Missouri:

---------
 

They’re so lucky that we’re peaceful. Law enforcement, military, construction workers, Bikers for Trump -- how about Bikers for Trump? They travel all over the country. They got Trump all over the place, and they’re great. They’ve been great. But these are tough people. These are great people. But they’re peaceful people, and Antifa and all -- they’d better hope they stay that way. I hope they stay that way. I hope they stay that way. 

-----------

Trump’s public comments are often more strategic than his critics give him credit for. He will routinely suggest something without technically saying, “This is what I want.” And he will generally lather himself in plausible deniability. “It would be very bad” and “I hope they stay that way” allow him to say he doesn’t actually want this thing he’s hinting at to happen.

 But it’s clear from these comments, and the repetition of this formula, that he’s suggesting his supporters from the military, law enforcement and even bikers could be tempted to rise up if things don’t go Trump’s way. He’s at the very least toying with the idea that things could become violent.

 And his inclusion of the police and the military is conspicuous. Remember a few weeks ago when his former personal attorney Michael Cohen was testifying before a House committee, Cohen said at the end of his testimony that he decided to speak out against Trump because he feared that if Trump lost the 2020 election, he wouldn’t leave. Experts rightly point out that any successful Trump effort to actually stay in office would probably require the complicity of the military, what would essentially be a coup. That’s nearly impossible to imagine.

 (The inclusion of bikers is also interesting — and timely. As The Post wrote last week, motorcycle gangs known as “colectivos” have served as enforcers for embattled Venezuelan President Nicolás Maduro. That, of course, wouldn’t explain why Trump included bikers when he said this in September.)

 But even if a coup seems patently ridiculous, that doesn’t mean there couldn’t be unrest, and it doesn’t mean that Trump isn’t proactively wielding that possibility for leverage against his opponents. Hinting that efforts to remove him from office — either via the 2020 election or impeachment — could be met with this kind of violence serves notice to his foes that they better play nice . . . and maybe investigators should back off.

 The idea that anything like the scenes Trump is describing would ever happen is difficult to believe. But that’s not really the point. Musing about this kind of thing is a great way to plant a seed in certain people’s minds, and the fact that Trump keeps fertilizing that seed shouldn’t escape notice.

 
https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/back-trump-comments-perceived-encouraging-violence/story?id=48415766

snips from article:

"President Donald Trump on Thursday praised a congressman’s past assault on a reporter, making it the latest example where he appears to encourage or support violence.   In the latest instance, Trump referenced Rep. Greg Gianforte’s 2017 attack on a reporter by saying that “any guy who can do a body slam, he is my type!”

-------------------

"Decades before launching his political career, Trump started crafting his public image with the release of his book "The Art of the Deal," which was published in 1987. In that book, he described an incident when he was younger that stood out as a memorable moment.

"Even in elementary school, I was a very assertive, aggressive kid," Trump wrote in the bestseller. "In the second grade I actually gave a teacher a black eye — I punched my music teacher because I didn't think he knew anything about music and I almost got expelled. I'm not proud of that but it's clear evidence that even early on I had a tendency to stand up and make my opinions known in a very forceful way. The difference now is that I like to use my brain instead of my fists." 
(Sia: except that he still tries to use his fists as shown by further examples)
------------------

"Protesters regularly interrupted Trump's rallies during the presidential campaign — which he often mentioned in his speeches.

 In Cedar Rapids, Iowa, on the day of the Iowa caucuses, for instance, he told audience members he would pay their legal fees if they engaged in violence against protesters.

 "If you see somebody getting ready to throw a tomato, knock the crap out of them, would you? Seriously, OK? Just knock the hell ... I promise you I will pay for the legal fees. I promise, I promise," he said on Feb. 1, 2016.

 At a Las Vegas rally later that month, he said security guards were too gentle with a protester. "He's walking out with big high-fives, smiling, laughing," Trump said. "I'd like to punch him in the face, I'll tell you."

 A similar situation unfolded at a rally that month in Warren, Michigan.

 "Get him out," he said of a protester. "Try not to hurt him. If you do, I'll defend you in court. Don't worry about it."

-------------------

Even though most of Trump's public remarks now come during appearances with world leaders at the White House and less often at rallies across the country, some of his acerbic comments have followed him.

 Three protesters who claim they were roughed up by Trump supporters at a March 1, 2016, rally in Louisville, Kentucky, have filed a federal suit against Trump, accusing him of inciting violence.

 His lawyers tried to get the case dismissed by saying his comments are protected by the First Amendment's guarantee of freedom of speech and that he did not intend for his words to incite violence.

 But federal Judge David Hale rejected that argument in April 2017 and said there was sufficient evidence that the protesters' injuries were a "direct and proximate result" of Trump's comments, according to The Associated Press. Trump was allowed to appeal the case, and Judge Hale signed an order to dismiss the claims in September 2018. The latest filing in the case was a petition for a rehearing which was filed on the appeals docket days after the order to dismiss.

------------------
 "Please don't be too nice" to suspects, Trump tells police 

Trump seemed to encourage police to be more violent in handling potential offenders during a speech to law enforcement officers in July 2017.

 The speech was largely focused on the threat posed by the gang MS-13, but it appeared that Trump was speaking in general when he commented on police interactions with suspected criminals.

 He described the precautions typically taken by police where they place a hand over a suspect's head while they're being put into a police car in order to protect them.

 "When you see these thugs being thrown into the back of a paddy wagon, you just seen them thrown in, rough. I said, 'Please don’t be too nice,'" he said.

 "When you guys put somebody in the car and you’re protecting their head you know, the way you put their hand over [their head]," Trump continued, mimicking the motion. "Like, 'Don’t hit their head and they’ve just killed somebody, don’t hit their head.' I said, 'You can take the hand away, OK?'

------------------------

On July 2, 2017, Trump shared the doctored video, from a 2007 WWE skit in which he is seen taking down WWE owner Vince McMahon. In the version Trump shared, McMahon's face is blocked by the CNN logo. 
(Sia: Obviously it was a doctored video, but he CHOSE to share it to make a point suggesting violence against CNN.

--------------------
During a rally for Montana Republicans ahead of the midterms, Trump praised Rep. Greg Gianforte, who allegedly body slammed a reporter back when he was initially running for his congressional seat in 2017.

 "Any guy that can do a body slam, he is my type!" Trump said on Thursday to cheers.

 The referenced body-slam happened in May 2017 when then-candidate Gianforte attacked reporter Ben Jacobs.

---------------------------------

Those are just a handful of examples.

OBVIOUSLY, tRUMP & company have denied that he advocates violence, even in all of these situations, but the proof is in the pudding...